SURFERMAG.COM - CURRENT ISSUE

SURFER: Where would those be?

MARTIN DALY: New Guinea. It's the only place I can think of where the reefs were totally pristine. And that's pretty sad. Nowhere in Indonesia. The Mentawais in 1990 were pristine. Now it's pretty screwed.

SURFER: And The Crossing's third task concerns indigenous people?

MARTIN DALY: It's being sensitive and mindful that everyone has values. One example of the conflict between the third world and the first is we are so sure we are right so we impose our values on others. When we were in New Guinea this guy with tribal scars paddled up to the boat and said in perfect English, "So you folks from Greenpeace or something?" When I told him we were just looking for surf he said, "I have never seen anyone surf here before." Turns out he went to university in Australia. I asked why he came back and he said, "Well I gave it a go, but I'd rather be back here. Life is more defined and more satisfying." That was nice to have someone explain it to me so succinctly.

SURFER: Where is the safest surf destination in the world right now?

MARTIN DALY: West Australia. 3,000 miles of ocean on one side and 3,000 miles of desert on the other. It's off everyone's radar.

SURFER: And the most dangerous?

MARTIN DALY: Yemen. And the Philippines is way up there. Everyone has guns. I was there in 1999 and I was so happy to get out. On a boat you're so vulnerable. People came on board with M16s. They could've been the Philippine Cavalry, Coast Guard, Navy or police--they never wear uniforms. They had bandoleers of ammo and T-shirts that said "I Love NYC." I just got really nervous. When we were doing salvage work over there, guys would come inside fully armed every day. That never happens in Indo.

SURFER: Was that the hairiest experience you ever had on a boat?

MARTIN DALY: No. It was on that original boat to the Mentawais with Tom and Ross. It was docked in Java, caught fire and my friend's wife and his son were sleeping. They burned to death. At that time I was really charging business-wise with the diving. I thought these people died in the pursuit of my ambitions and it was difficult to deal with. I re-evaluated everything and decided to go the surfing route because all my friends in diving were putting themselves at risk. It would be my pursuit of money that put people in that position in the first place. I was really happy to get out of the diving business.

SURFER: You were in Indo during the first Gulf War. How was that climate compared to the climate today?

MARTIN DALY: Now it's not so clear. The world is an unhappier place now because of all the religious and cultural intolerance. I have lived with Muslim people for 23 years and I don't have a problem with them because I understand and know them. The Indonesian people, in particular, are really nice, honest and straightforward. It's the Australians and Americans who have caused all my problems in Indonesia. Obviously the Indonesians are poor and that creates some petty crime, but it's blown out of proportion.

SURFER: What's the difference between traveling overland and traveling on a boat around the world?

MARTIN DALY: The boat is fantastic because it's like your own little country. It's familiar because you have your own stuff and you can hide on the boat.

SURFER: But in the Philippines they just came onboard.

MARTIN DALY: That's true. But in general, you can isolate yourself from the local population. It's not as core as going by land, having no choice but to immerse in local culture. On a boat you have to force yourself to go on the beach. Ninety percent of the time the boat is the best vehicle. But on land I think it's more authentic or more of a rounded experience. When we see guys crawling out of the bushes we salute them. But I think there are different kinds of surfers. I have this charter thing I aim at the older guys who have limited time to go surfing. It's a matter of age and deserving. If I see a boatload of young pro surfers getting paid a lot of money, they've basically jumped about four steps in the earning process and can't really appreciate it. But when the older guys go away for two weeks, they deserve to have a good time.

SURFER: How did you react to having competitors in the Mentawais?

MARTIN DALY: I didn't have much trouble with that because two or three years after I was really established, all these guys showed up out of nowhere. It got really ugly fast. It has calmed down now but it has all been a study in greed and selfishness. Everyone talks about the Mentawai surfing industry and I mean the whole thing is so small. People say it's worth about $20 million a year, which is complete rubbish. If people spend $3 million a year I would be surprised. And most of that money is left in Indo for fuel, repair, food and wages. People make a big fuss but he whole thing is pretty small.

SURFER: Small, but big in Indonesian terms?

MARTIN DALY: Not even that. When I first went to the Mentawais they had no use for money. I remember buying a canoe from some guys and I tried giving them money and they wondered if I had anything else to trade. They can't do anything with it. Never mind surfing, the Mentawai logging industry turns over daily what the surfing industry does annually. Because of what people think of my business, they ask me, "What are you doing about the indigenous people and their welfare?" And I just want to go surfing. I probably feel for them more than most people do and I'm surrounded by surfing-industry types moralizing to me while they selfishly guard their own little bit of turf. I bring people from all around the world to the Mentawais who behave so badly at their own local beach, but when they travel they expect to be treated. If there is anything like a local in the Mentawais, I'm it--surfing-wise, anyway. But I never feel any ownership.

SURFER: Do you feel a duty to protect the resources?

MARTIN DALY: Well the only thing we feel is to try and make the best of it. We used to take surfing by ourselves for granted. Now we like to think people will behave.

SURFER: It seems the Mentawais have been done to death. Do you think they should be left alone for a while?

MARTIN DALY: The Mentawais do need a rest now. I thought the magazines would be over it in 1997. How wrong I was. But I have to pay the bills so I can go surfing, and I guess the fact the surf is so consistent is why people come back.

SURFER: You mentioned the first time you were there you discovered your Shangri-La. Was there any desire to share it?

MARTIN DALY: Absolutely not! Maximum three guys out--lets go! Obviously the perfect surf is where you go out by yourself. We did talk about development, hotels and exploitation when we first pulled up to Lance's. The first thing you think of when you have a discovery like that is ownership. But it was clear right away that was unrealistic with my lack of experience back then. So I had a meeting with the village chief. I said basically, "Us coming here has changed your lives forever. Don't sell your land to anybody. There are going to be people coming here to surf, all sorts of things will happen. Hang on to it because it's your land and maybe one day you will benefit from it." And, well, they are.

SURFER: You have seen a lot of terrific surfing in your lifetime. Who do you enjoy watching in the water?

MARTIN DALY: If the surf is big, Tom Carroll more than anybody else. Tom Curren, Kelly Slater and Occy are in there, too. And Martin Potter. He is so spontaneous, cutting and drawing different lines. I remember taking Bruce Irons and Damien Hobgood to One Palm when they were groms and I realized how far above the rest of the crew they were. You can't really surf there when it's small because of the sketchy reef. But these guys were giggling and laughing, pulling in and dodging rocks in the barrel and I wouldn't even go near it.

SURFER: What is the most remote place you found waves?

MARTIN DALY: There have been so many. But there's this mythical place and no one is going to screw it up. We looked and looked and we found it. I am not going to say what ocean it's in. You have to find it yourself.